Curse

ightgg · May 04, 2010, 09:58 PM // 21:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fay Vert

ANet are great because they made Prophesies with great story, gameplay and design philosophy. Then they gave us Sorrow's Furnace! Brilliant!

If they ever want to know what they did right, just look back to those days.

Thank GOD anet will never be remembered for prophecies. The thing that keeps players around is progression, not "remembering the glory days". That point of view is over played on this forum and obviously isnt being acknowledged by anet because its just plain bad for business to repeat the same thing over and over again in a game. Yah it might be okay to tweek it a little and reproduce it but im sure anet isnt making most of their money right now selling copies of prophecies.

Test Me · May 04, 2010, 10:07 PM // 22:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abedeus

Sorry, in the past 2 or 3 years they haven't done anything redeeming enough to make me buy GW2.

Sorry to say it but: this ^ ^

Since the last anniversary I have spent with ANet enough to buy me several new games:
- bought all 4 storage panes,
- bought all constumes, and
- a makeover pack
(and probably more i don't remember now).

I hoped that by these "micro"-transactions they will get an influx of money helping them release more content for GW1. And I didn't mind buying all that considering the number of years I've played and enjoyed GW1.

The reality was totally different though: they enjoyed the money and couldn't care less about providing something back. Those micro-transactions were not there to sponsor better support for GW1 or new content or anything, they were put there just because ANet believed they could milk their players more for nothing in return. And it turns they were right.

I'm not saying I will not buy GW2 when it comes out, but I will not spend another cent more on GW1. Especially the last birthday event when the only thing they managed to get out in time was (go figure) another overly priced costume pack. How comes that wasn't delayed? Whatever...

I'm normally not this negative, but I think ANet went over the line this time.

Zarion Silverarrow · May 04, 2010, 10:14 PM // 22:14

Another thing,they involve themselves completely in the community (ie Regina) and help people in forums. This may be the same for other games like WoW (altough i plain just don't know if it is) BUT remember,you dont Pay to Play.

Buying things in game cannot fu-- up the game in any way,UNLESS the item being sold provides advantages from others (like an armor that has +1000 armor for fire or something) Do they sell that?No. What they do sell is optional stuff that helps pay for the server maintainence. If you expect them to make it not Pay to Play,without anything to sell in game,then you are the most naive person i have ever met...Go ahead and ask for the actual game to be free then....lets see how the servers act after than and how the support gets ""better"".

@ Dusk_ I agree with all of your points more or less,thank you (PS: I know i basically just said what you did,but i wanted to make my opinion clear

)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Test Me

Sorry to say it but: this ^ ^

Since the last anniversary I have spent with ANet enough to buy me several new games:
- bought all 4 storage panes,
- bought all constumes, and
- a makeover pack
(and probably more i don't remember now).

I hoped that by these "micro"-transactions they will get an influx of money helping them release more content for GW1. And I didn't mind buying all that considering the number of years I've played and enjoyed GW1.

The reality was totally different though: they enjoyed the money and couldn't care less about providing something back. Those micro-transactions were not there to sponsor better support for GW1 or new content or anything, they were put there just because ANet believed they could milk their players more for nothing in return. And it turns they were right.

I'm not saying I will not buy GW2 when it comes out, but I will not spend another cent more on GW1. Especially the last birthday event when the only thing they managed to get out in time was (go figure) another overly priced costume pack. How comes that wasn't delayed? Whatever...

I'm normally not this negative, but I think ANet went over the line this time.

I am in no way insulting your opinion or anything,but just answer this.

Why would they make stuff to sell,just to get money to sell other things. They wouldn't get any profit.

I'd rather have them use the money for keeping the servers stable,giving the employees money,etc. IF there is any leftover money then yea,make more content and repeat the cycle. BUT I don't know of anyone in my guild or in the game that bought anything from it,other than my GL who bought a costume pack

Test Me · May 04, 2010, 10:23 PM // 22:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

I'd rather have them use the money for keeping the servers stable,giving the employees money,etc. IF there is any leftover money then yea,make more content and repeat the cycle. BUT I don't know of anyone in my guild or in the game that bought anything from it,other than my GL who bought a costume pack

I did mention "or better support".

I have seen neither. Their severs are in a deplorable state compared to 3 years ago, their updates and the bugs they introduce with each and every updates of past year are just outcrying ridiculous, their policy to release updates every two months turned in twice a year.... What more can be said?

For references go read the number of excuses for server issues on twitter of past months and look at the update history of bugs/reverts and fix of the fix of the fix of the update of the same or passed day. Things are just falling apart.

sixdartbart · May 04, 2010, 10:27 PM // 22:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Test Me

Sorry to say it but: this ^ ^

Since the last anniversary I have spent with ANet enough to buy me several new games:
- bought all 4 storage panes,
- bought all constumes, and
- a makeover pack
(and probably more i don't remember now).

I hoped that by these "micro"-transactions they will get an influx of money helping them release more content for GW1. And I didn't mind buying all that considering the number of years I've played and enjoyed GW1.

Heres the key

Quote:

Originally Posted by Test Me

I hoped

now please tell us where exactly Anet promised new content if you bought new dresses so you could be a pretty little princess?

All of this pissing and moaning is getting old!
Bottom line is GWs does not charge you to play aside from what you paid to purchase the game, they also have never promised new content for free but have given a lot of it.
They have offered "OPTIONAL" non game influencing items through micro transactions so that you can play dressup or whatever floats your boat and they can make a few bucks to keep cash flowing to justify keeping the game online rather than just shutting it down and moving to their next project like most companies do.

So it seems that you ended up with extra closet space for your new dresses and a makeover, in turn Anet made a couple bucks, if they and their game is sooooo terrible just move on and stop constantly crying on the forums about how terrible they are!!!

Test Me · May 04, 2010, 10:38 PM // 22:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixdartbart

Heres the key

So if you were a business that wanted to make money you'd care more about customers unwilling to spend a cent with your business (you) or you'd care about customers that give you business by constantly buying your stuff?

I think the answer is pretty obvious. So I, as a customer that have spent money with ANet have the right to say that I feel my money haven't been put to any use and I feel "milked". Even more, the fact that I've actually spent the money with them kinda gives me all the rights to criticize them (or call it "QQ/bitch" whatever). Unlike you who just benefited from the influx of money customers like me gave them (if any benefit at all).

You should be thankful for every bone they throw for free, paying customer will have some expectations on the other hand. Enough said.

EDIT (inline answer for bellow):

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixdartbart

So your point is that...

Do yourself a favor, don't ever run a business.
No the point is: they've lost a paying customer. I don't care if they don't care about loosing paying customers, just saying.

sixdartbart · May 04, 2010, 10:50 PM // 22:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Test Me

So if you were a business that wanted to make money you'd care more about customers unwilling to spend a cent with your business (you) or you'd care about customers that give you business by constantly buying your stuff?

I think the answer is pretty obvious. So I, as a customer that have spent money with ANet have the right to say that I feel my money haven't been put to any use and I feel "milked". Even more, the fact that I've actually spent the money with them kinda gives me all the rights to criticize them (or call it "QQ/bitch" whatever). Unlike you who just benefited from the influx of money customers like me gave them (if any benefit at all).

You should be thankful for every bone they throw for free, paying customer will have some expectations on the other hand. Enough said.

So your point is that you got exactly what you paid for and "HOPED" they would give you something extra, since they didn't you will trash them endlessly for not giving you something that they NEVER said they would.

sorry for the rough translation but most of your post made no sense whatsoever

I do agree with this however

Quote:

Originally Posted by Test Me

Enough said.

the more you say the worse it seems to get

BlackSephir · May 04, 2010, 10:51 PM // 22:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixdartbart

Bottom line is GWs does not charge you to play aside from what you paid to purchase the game

That's your bottom line? I thought bottom lines are supposed to be strong.
I know dev companies that even when they had gone defunct they'd still make patches for games they made. For free. Additionally, look at that evil, evil Blizzard and what they did to Diablo 2 which also is OOOOOLDDDD and subscription free.
If AN thinks they'd get customers without updates, be my guest, see how it'll work out.
Bottom line is: GW was supposed to deliver updates and constant content WHILE being subscription-free. And, depending on how you define "content", they either failed miserably or did not so good.
I for one define content as something that adds to gameplay and oooh boooy, at a time I was even so naive that I thought they're going to add AB maps and stuff!

IlikeGW · May 04, 2010, 10:57 PM // 22:57

I like that they try new things and at least get them done in a playable form. Sadly to say, few companies can do that. I also like that they don't just look at the status quo and do the same thing. Again, few companies are like this. As much as people get mad at Anet over long term play of GW1 - having put 100's or 1000's of hours in for a game that unfortunately wasn't made to stay fun for that amount of time, I still think Anet kicks everyone else's ass in the MMO genre. I'm just dog tired of GW1 years ago really, but... I see that in GW2 they didn't rest on their laurels. They aren't just RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing us over with no more GW1 to make a clone sequel... they're rewriting everything to try and do it toward a whole new vision really. And that is in a way inspiring.

sixdartbart · May 04, 2010, 10:58 PM // 22:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

Bottom line is: GW was supposed to deliver updates and constant content WHILE being subscription-free.

ohhh please do source this for us.

ROFL

colosusjokers · May 04, 2010, 11:08 PM // 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixdartbart

Heres the key

now please tell us where exactly Anet promised new content if you bought new dresses so you could be a pretty little princess?

All of this pissing and moaning is getting old!
Bottom line is GWs does not charge you to play aside from what you paid to purchase the game, they also have never promised new content for free but have given a lot of it.
They have offered "OPTIONAL" non game influencing items through micro transactions so that you can play dressup or whatever floats your boat and they can make a few bucks to keep cash flowing to justify keeping the game online rather than just shutting it down and moving to their next project like most companies do.

So it seems that you ended up with extra closet space for your new dresses and a makeover, in turn Anet made a couple bucks, if they and their game is sooooo terrible just move on and stop constantly crying on the forums about how terrible they are!!!

This pretty much sums it up.

I bought a number of the things from the in game store and I'm glad that I did. If I didn't think it was worth paying a bit for I wouldn't be playing Guild Wars to begin with. It would seem that some folks here don't think it is and so the only reasonable answer to why they are playing or coming to a Guild wars forum is that they are full blown retarded.

The costumes look nice and are sometimes fun to have on when playing. Also, I bought all of the storage slots and I still don't have enough storage.

Avoc · May 04, 2010, 11:11 PM // 23:11

Holy shit @ these forums.

I really hope gw2guru will not turn into this in a couple of years.

Test Me · May 04, 2010, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by colosusjokers

It would seem that some folks here don't think it is and so the only reasonable answer to why they are playing or coming to a Guild wars forum is that they are full blown retarded.

Yes I see now. I am wrong, please forgive me. GW is the perfect game ever and ANet is the perfect game studio with stellar updates, support and server uptime.

I will go now and enjoy my happy time in GW, still remembering all the joy and happiness of the GW turning 5 event! Never felt so good in any game before! They've outdone themselves this time.

#OBEY

AmbientMelody · May 04, 2010, 11:15 PM // 23:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Test Me

So if you were a business that wanted to make money you'd care more about customers unwilling to spend a cent with your business (you) or you'd care about customers that give you business by constantly buying your stuff?

I think the answer is pretty obvious. So I, as a customer that have spent money with ANet have the right to say that I feel my money haven't been put to any use and I feel "milked". Even more, the fact that I've actually spent the money with them kinda gives me all the rights to criticize them (or call it "QQ/bitch" whatever). Unlike you who just benefited from the influx of money customers like me gave them (if any benefit at all).

You should be thankful for every bone they throw for free, paying customer will have some expectations on the other hand. Enough said.

You Sir, know very little about MMOs.

They make money on maintaining player base and expanding it, not constantly 'ripping off' new people which become 'old' after new expansion and can be thrown to the trash bin.

It's the same for f2p, b2p and p2p MMOs. Given the fact that most successful MMO games of their times were p2p, any and all deviations from this model face their own ADDITIONAL challenges to keep the content fresh and interesting.

Business model is a tool, it gets job done. But business model is not a genre, and keeping your customers happy after they've spent money on your product is equally important as producing that new content on sale.

MMOs are all about society. You don't build a society based around 'pay us $$ for new expansion or go screw yourself', that's not even how a business is made. MMOs aren't food you know, you don't die if you don't 'consume' them. No kind of entertainment company would stay in the market with the kind of attitude you are describing, simply for the sake of their playerbase moving onto another game, what is especially important (but not only) for p2p business. However, the rule is similar, when you turn off a customer in highly competitive and dynamic market, he will likely not want to spend money on your products again and will even bad-mouth your entire company, hurting your potential base of customers.

In no way I mean to insult you, of course, and whatever opinion you have on this topic. Nevertheless, it doesn't change the simple facts of MMO industry.

EDIT:

Also, please define what you mean by 'paying customer'. In one sentence you claim someone should be grateful for everything he gets 'for free', since he already paid for it, and in the other you pretty much highlight the point I'm trying to make, here. So, is the 'customer' buying expansions a 'paying customer' or not? Worthy of being cared for what he paid or only milked for new expansions? It could be nice if you cleaned your posts to CLEARLY state what you WANT to say.

On a side note, it seems some people don't actually appreciate all kinds of (more or less) timely bug fixes and balance updates (which more or less address the core problem). Yes, that IS content, because in MMOs keeping entire content accessible and enjoyable is crucial. Despite that, of course, one might argue that they add very little stuff later, unless you are going to pay for next expansion ... however when you look into costs, maintaining the game you've already paid for can cost as much if not more as developing new 'core' content. When they shifted majority of resources to GW2 project, microtransactions had to be more widely introduced. If anything, they found their business model lacking in funding whatever they wanted to achieve, as well as campaign each 1/2 year highly unrealistic (whereas most p2p MMOs bring out a HUGE update every year, and paid expansion each 2/3 years).

Naturally, how Anet has been handling the GW over the years is discussable. They've had their pitfalls, and many of them, and so will the GW2 have them. However, if anyone thinks that he will be getting a 'better treat' over 'luxurious p2p MMO', is wrong. That is coming from my own experience and that of my closest relatives, at the very least. MMOs are massive games based around social engineering, and face MASSIVE problems not only of technical or financial nature in order to flourish and operate. In fact, many of them are designed to work 'very well' for 1-2 years, 'well' for next 1-2 and start to very rapidly decline shortly after that, further and further draining money from most loyal database, bringing less actual content (higher maintenance costs including preventive and active anti-botting, anti-RMT measures) and focusing more around creating 'buzz' for smoother transition to the new game.

Most of such MMOs experience a 'crisis' in their lifecycle, and the end of the 'good' period is usually signalised by botters & cheaters running wild, community permanently declining into fanboys versus haters in-game & forum wars as well as the 'Senior' content staff working full-steam on new game in the series, leaving the rookies to learn how to maintain an MMO and produce content for it. That is no stranger really, that is a business. GW was left out, because it had no future in it's current shape and form. Just look how GW2 is different. It's not GuildWars anymore, it's GuildWars-inspired generic action-oriented MMO with extensive storyline and roleplaying.

Thevil King · May 04, 2010, 11:29 PM // 23:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

1.Their support (helping with lost password,email,etc) is good.

you may think so, but from me and my friends experience, no quite so. especially not when it takes days for reply, and when they do, they do not have anything useful to say. common stuff includes: hi thank you for your support, you will be directed to xxx of some other department, etc, most of the time it is just random filler that does not really do much.

Quote:

2.They sell stuff in-game like costumes and all that. Fun stuff that IS NOT obligatory to buy.

aka cash shop, if you played other f2p games, u will find ALMOST EVERY game has that. why? they need to make $$$. i do not get how this makes anet any different, or any better, than these other companies

Quote:

3.Even tho their support to GW1 has lowered,we know that this means they are working VERY hard on GW2,and possibly everything will balance out once GW2 is done.

they are only hyping gw2 up. honest, with what anet has done to gw in the past few yrs, i have lost a significant amount of confidence in their company. i will certainly TRY gw2, but i am not so enthusiastic about it as i was 2 or 3 years ago, because the way anet has treated their game in this time period. consquently, i will only believe what i see when we actually get the game, not when its being hyped up for more than 2 yrs.

Quote:

4.They rarely ever have server problems,although there have been it is rare.

idk about you, but gw for me have become laggier in the past few years. and for asian players, it is worse. for example, ncsoft made a very bad choice for the gw publisher in taiwan, and ever since they abandoned the publisher 2yrs ago, most chinese players i know have horrible lag. to the point that some of them are forced to go afk for hours just because it is too laggy to play.

Quote:

5.They made Guild Wars very begginer friendly,let the community interact with order,and made finishing the game worthwhile (missions are fun+endgame areas)

this is true to a certain degree, the instance feature and such in gw is unique, and learning curve not quite as steep. however, once the mission is finished, there really is no incentive to go back to it again. in 1 acct, u have to go do it more than 4 or 5 times for different char, and it just gets worse and worse each time, but that is inevitable.

Quote:

6.You can play whenever you want. Want to take a break for 2 yrs and come back?Sure,your account will still be there,untouched.

theoretically this may be true. but i know people who has quit for 1 or 2 yrs and came back, just to find that their accts have been hacked. they still have the acct, but it is not untouched, as all their gold and items are gone. no, do not even bring up the security bs, it is been expounded on like forever. my friend went to anet support, and they could not do shit about it(good support yea). this might have something to do with the security debacle a couple of months ago, but now i do not even feel secure about my acct anymore.

though gw is a unique and good game, anet overall is not as a good company as the op would think. yes they are passionate about the game, but really from what has happened in the past few years they have made some sersly bad choices. honestly it kinda dissapoints me to see what have become of this once great game, and anet does not exhibit much competence at maintaining their game.

Kattar · May 04, 2010, 11:33 PM // 23:33

Turned out about how I thought it would.

Time to put out the aggro fire before you all end up even more at each others' throats.